Whether you're starting out in the middle of your career, everyone wants to start staying in the job at some point. How you can own a note for two days and determine so much about what your experience and that job will be like. In this episode, we're taking how you can maximize your challenge that you can also find start and left the role. And have a random channel to be on the final time. This is all about how you can hyper running with a great presentation and going to become. Welcome to the Gen XD Exchange. I'm Chris Perkins, Gen X parent, now 50 something empty nest of. And I'm Lily Perkins, Gen Z Career Explorer. We told them to take on career choices, work, and life in general. So whether you're a Gen X parent trying to figure out midlife challenges. Or a Gen Z young professional or student figuring out adulthood, you're in the right place. So Lily, this topic came about because you've just landed a new job. Congratulations. Thank you. Tell us a bit more about it. Yeah, so I'm really excited to get started with it all. It's basically like a tech startup role where I'll be writing some content, and the aim is all to do with reducing children's screen time. And obviously, I'm really undressing in children's online safety, all that kind of thing. So it is right up my street, and I'm really excited to expand my writing skills a little bit, build on all that. Yeah, it's gonna be really good. That's fantastic. And I'm really excited for you. It's a a great first step kind of professional role, you know, breaking out of all of the kind of student jobs you've had up to this point. So well done. Thank you very much. Yeah, it's just an internship. So it's not like I'm gonna be CEO. So there's that, which takes a bit of the pressure off. But do you still think I can pick it up as I go? To some extent, but I think it is worth preparing for stepping into a new role. Yeah. You know, we like some stats to set the scene. So here are some for the first 90 days in a new job to be aware of. So some survey data from the CIPD and HR Bench said up to 41% of employers report that new recruits resign or fail within the first 12 weeks. Right. And around a quarter of all voluntary employee turnover, so people who are choosing to leave, happens within the first 45 to 90 days. So it is a really critical period. Uh, another survey from the recruitment firm Robert Walters and Corn Ferry found 53% of UK professionals have quit a new role within the first six months. And the most common reason for walking away was the day-to-day role was completely different from how it was advertised. So, you know, that's something to be cautious of. And another recruitment firm, appointments personnel, found 33% of all new employees leave within the first 90 days of starting a role. Yikes. For Gen X's, the stakes are even higher. So data from the Society of Human Resource Management in the US says 50% of senior outside hires fail within the first 18 months. So even with a lot of experience, that doesn't guarantee you're going to be successful in a new role. So if you're starting your very first remote internship, like you, or stepping into a senior corporate role, it really pays to pay attention to the first 90 days. You're not filling me with hope, but I'm ready for the rest of your advice, which hopefully well will increase the chances that your first 90 days and beyond will be really successful. The best approach to that just so happens to be a book called The First 90 Days by someone called Michael Watkins. I bought my copy way back in 2003. That was the year you were born, blind. It was. And I've recommended it to loads of people ever since. So I'm gonna pick on some of that to kind of talk you through some things to be thinking about. We'll cover some more up-to-date things, like making a good start in a fully remote role, because that's what yours is. Yep. But would you like to know the basics of what Michael Watkins says is the best way to start? Absolutely, fire in. Okay. So if you think of the first 30 days as listen, learn and map, and don't feel you need to prove yourself in week one. I think coming in as an intern, there hopefully won't be that expectation. But your job in that first month or so is to soak up as much as you can about the culture and how things get done at the company. And one of the things you'll want to do is try and get the lie of the land in terms of who the power sits with, because it's not always the most senior person in the room. So if you think about all the jobs you've had so far, which have all kind of been hospitality, how would you say you are at sussing out who has the power and influence in the organization? I think okay, you would generally assume that your managers and higher ups are the ones in charge. But I guess there has been a couple of times where I get a bit further along in a job and realize, oh, there's an employee here who's really cozy in with the manager and is able to get shifts off that other people can't get, or there's someone who can get away with more than others, or you know, whatever. So I guess okay, average, maybe better than average. Yeah, I think you're pretty well tuned into that kind of stuff, but you've got to bear in mind all your jobs up to now have been in physical workspaces, you know. Yes. You've been present. Uh so you can see who has lunch together, who socializes outside of work, that kind of stuff. Yeah, that makes a difference, definitely. Whereas remotely, you will need to look at who the big voices are on whatever internal communication channels they've got, things like Slack or Teams, other kind of internal communications platforms to see how actually things get done. When you are remote, sometimes you can pick up on things that would indicate who the influencers are. So, for example, if you pay attention to who is getting tagged in Slack, if that's what they're they're using when a crisis happens, let's say three different people tag the same person, the same manager saying, Hey, can you take a look at this? That is the person to pay attention to. Uh, find who that person is, get to know them. Okay, that makes sense for someone like me, but then maybe for the Gen Xers, what if you're a senior executive, for example? You know, if they're paying you the big bucks to get the job done, do they not expect you to start changing things and getting the job done by like five days in? Nope, not straight away. Same applies. So a massive trap for senior professionals is falling into this idea that you've got to take action straight away. If you come in with pre-packaged answers from your old job, that can be fatal for building trust with your team. So it's exactly the same for senior leaders. The first 30 days, you still got to focus on learning the culture of the organization that you've just joined. It's just that you've had more experience and will recognise some themes and patterns quicker. Right. Yeah. So it's not like it's a one-size-fits-all approach just because you've been somewhere else. Yeah. Um, so with that in mind, how can I get up to speed as quickly as possible then within this first 30 days? So I would say there are three things that will give you some clues to the culture. The first is symbols, and that can be everything from logos and presentations to how people dress. What you're looking for are the signs of how people recognize that they're part of the team. So you might be able to pick up on some of those things. The second is the the norms in the workplace, albeit that it is remote. So what seems to be the right kind of behavior? So look for what gets rewarded or encouraged and and what gets maybe disapproving looks if you notice someone maybe says something out of turn in a meeting. Again, it's harder to see when you're remote, so you've got to pay attention to what's going on on the team calls and in the comms channels. And the third thing is assumptions. So try and suss out what the beliefs that underpin the social system in the organization are and what it is that everyone just takes for granted in terms of kind of how things work around here. Okay, but how do I find all this out? Like, especially for me if I'm in like a remote kind of role, like I can't really see what someone's wearing head to toe. Do you know what I mean? Yeah, that that's true. The key thing is to find the best sources of information. So they'll give you some kind of induction training. You'll probably have to look at some stuff, but actually, you want to figure out who are the people with some key perspectives. And apart from your boss and maybe other managers, there are three kinds of people you're looking for. So the first are the builders, so the people on the front line building the product, they can familiarize you with the key relationships in the organization, what it's like on the front line with what they're building, particularly given that they're they're a startup. Then you have anyone in a sales role. So if they're already building out a sales team, those are the people who are telling stories about the company to potential customers. And you can learn a lot by asking how they do that and what really seems to resonate with customers. So the salespeople are good people to connect with. Yeah, that makes sense. And the third are the connectors or the integrators. So these are the people who coordinate everything, like the project managers, the product managers, they'll be able to help you understand how the links in the organization work and who the key people are and clue you in on any internal conflicts, which can be good to know when you're just starting out. Yeah, definitely. And there is a fourth, but this won't really apply in a startup. But um, apart from the founders, that fourth category that are good to get to know in more established organizations are the historians. So they can tell you about the company mythology, if you like, its its roots and its culture and its politics. So overall, a good approach to those th first 30 days is what Michael Watkins calls a learning agenda. So you're not just sitting there passively, you're hunting information from across those three pillars. So technical, how the product works, cultural, how people behave, and political, how decisions get made. Okay. So I need to remember those three pill those three pillars, right? Or those those three groups, yeah. So the sort of cultural, the technical, political. For a more experienced Gen Xer, their learning agenda needs to include kind of diagnosing the business situation. So if you're in a a startup, a turnaround, a realignment, or you're just sustaining success in a more established company. If you treat realignment like a turnaround, you're gonna alienate everyone by fixing things that aren't broken. And that's what I help you create. No one likes the mid-person coming in and rearranging things that didn't need rearranged. Exactly. That can apply for glasses in a bar or can apply to your big business stuff. It can indeed. Yeah, some interesting parallels. Okay, cool. So that sounds like that's the help for the first 30 days. That's all locked in. But then what should I be doing from 30 to 60 days the next month after that? So 30 to 60 days is about securing some early wins. So you're going to start to establish your reputation as being a good member of the team. Yeah, hopefully. So whatever your brief is, in terms of the first couple of pieces of work that you're asked to take on, you want to look for a small kind of low-risk problem that you can fix. So a couple of ideas could be things like how you can improve any of the onboarding documentation that you're given. If you can see things that are missing or things that are out of date, make some suggestions as to how they can improve it. Or like when you're shown, you know, where all the information is, the sort of content you're going to be working on, organizing a really messy shared Google Drive can help everyone out. That's the sort of thing that people might appreciate if you're being kind of proactive in in that respect. So an early win isn't just finishing a piece of work you were asked to do, it's about showing that you're slotting into that company culture. So your win, finishing a piece of work, is showing you can manage your own time without being chased. For someone more senior, an early win can be something like stopping a bad project that everyone was secretly hating anyway, or unblocking a bottleneck with budget or or something for the team. And that's about kind of signalling your leadership style that you want to be able to help remove barriers and help people make progress. But for you, it will be about not just kind of completing the work, but just doing a little extra. Yeah, I guess that's the advice you've always given me growing up as well. Like whether it was like sports or a hobby growing up, is like try and just give a little bit over the bare minimum. Like the bare minimum gets you by, but an extra little boost, an extra little top-up, that does build trust and a sense that you're gonna be the one to get things finished. Absolutely. You remember all those homework assignments from primary school onwards? We would say at you do more than the bare minimum. We were training you for this moment that you're gonna do more than the bare minimum. Yeah. And well, hopefully it's conditioned you to, you know, be a really useful team member when you you start a role like this. So you definitely want to ask your manager what what does success look like for me in the first 30 days and into to month two? Don't guess at what it is, so you know what's expected. And then try and over-deliver in some way. So yeah, more than the the bare minimum. So how will I then know what counts as a win for me, if that makes sense? Like, is that something, you know, maybe if I'm in a role that's not super like feedback heavy, I don't know if that's the right way to describe it. Do you know what I mean? Yeah, so a good motto to keep in mind when people eventually start asking you to do things is under promise over deliver. Okay. So if you think you can do something by Friday, tell them you'll get it to them by Monday or Tuesday and then deliver it on Friday. Okay. So that's way better than telling them that you'll do it by Friday and then not sending it till Monday, Tuesday. Yeah, because that sends the the opposite signal. Yeah. So yeah, and it gives you some wiggle room. If something takes a bit longer, is a bit more complex than you thought, or you need to speak to some other people, just give yourself obviously don't take ages, but yeah, under promise in the deliver. Exactly. Right. Yeah. And then from 60 to 90 days, your focus is on building consistency, developing a reputation for getting things done. So take some initiative. So when you spot things you think could be improved, be proactive, figure out a way to improve it, go to whoever owns that part of the operation and offer your suggestions or your solution. You don't need to do the work, but you show you're looking for ways to improve things and coming up with solutions. And that makes you a good person to have around. Yeah. So instead of flagging a problem when you see it, would you like to know my four problem-solving questions that you should think through and ask yourself? Yes, I think this would be really helpful because as you were saying that, I was thinking, how do you do this without coming across as like a know-it-all or being condescending or whatever, like someone in my position, kind of at the bottom of the food chain. Yeah, you don't want to be a a whiner. It's not, oh, this isn't working properly. Yeah, I don't like this. So this works in all sorts of situations. I I learned these four questions really early on in my management career into management training, and they've stood me in good stead ever since. So the first one is what's the problem? So you're really specific about it. This is missing or this isn't working, whatever it might be. The second one is what's the cause of the problem? So you mean may need to you know spend a bit of time investigating that, do what you can to figure out the root cause. Question three, what are all or some possible solutions? So you come up with some ideas as to how you think it could be solved. And then question four is which solution are you going to recommend? Right. So instead of going to someone saying, Hey, I found this problem and dumping it on them, yeah, not saying, I found this problem, I think this is what's causing it, and I think there are a few possible solutions like A, B, and C, and I think C is probably the most straightforward way to fix it, because whatever you've figured out, and whatever your reasoning is, what do you think? And then their reaction is probably gonna be, oh, that's great. They might ask you to do it, or they at least might ask you to make a start, but that's how you start building a reputation for yourself as a really valuable member of the team. So it's like being proactive, coming up with solutions when you spot things that can be fixed or improved. Okay, cool. So by the end of your first 90 days, you want to be having five mini conversations with your boss. So the first of those is the current situation. Are we agreeing on what this business needs from me? Yeah, and what will be kind of the next three months or so? Yeah. Expectations, what do I need to deliver next? So you want to be thinking ahead. Resources, what do I need to succeed? You might need more input from some people. Yeah. Number four is style, right? How do we best communicate, you and your boss, because everyone will have preferences. And then the fifth one is your personal development. How am I doing? And if there are areas where you think you need some support, you can ask. So those kind of conversations, I'm sure your boss will have regular reviews with you. Yeah. But covering those kind of things is kind of helping to kind of frame that conversation. And do you think being the person sometimes to check in, like being the one to ask how am I doing, is a good move, or will maybe other generations find that a bit annoying if you're you know constantly asking for feedback? Like where's the balance there? No, I think given that it's an internship, so they know you are cutting your teeth in this role, it's perfectly reasonable to ask, particularly when you first start delivering things for people, like completing pieces of work, ask for feedback. I used to have a boss who would say, Do you want your bad news now or later? And he was meaning in terms of sales, like do they want to buy or not? You know, ask them if they're gonna place the order. But it applies to all sorts of things. So if someone isn't happy with a piece of work, far better to know early on and then be able to work on that and improve it rather than brush under the carpet and then you know, the end of uh probation if there is one, or the end of the first 90 days, they're like, well, your work's been a bit mediocre. So then you've put in all that work and you could have napped it and got it started for an adjunct. Right. Give me some feedback. Okay, cool. So I think compared to when I started in an office job, the biggest challenge you have is now being fully remote. I mean, it's just so common now, but you don't get to see what people are doing around the office, and you don't get that socialization into the culture which I I had when I started out. Yeah. So in a remote startup, your visibility is is your responsibility. So if no one sees you working from what they can see from their online systems, you don't exist as far as they're concerned. So you can't just sit back and and wait for tasks and wait to be told. You need to be checking in with people, build your network from your bedroom with those check-ins and and asking, you know, if there are things, more things you can take on, kind of volunteer. Yeah. One of Grandad's best bits of career advice to me is really relevant to you in this situation. And that is keep everyone informed. Yep, of course. I remember that. Even if the update is there is no update, you don't want your boss or people who are expecting things from you to be thinking, I wonder how Lily's getting on with that thing. Yeah. So keep them updated, particularly if you think you might not be able to meet a deadline. Don't wait until the deadline. No. A couple of days before, saying, Hey, this is taking a bit longer than I thought. I think I'm gonna need some time. If they say no, we absolutely have to have it on this day, then you're just gonna need to pull out the stops uh and and do it. So yeah, but that's useful and no one wants that. So maybe trying to get in the early doors as the reason. Exactly. Yeah. Keep them updated. So maybe every Friday morning you send a list of three bullet points to your boss or the people you're doing things for saying, Here's where I'm up to. Yeah. And if you finish a task, don't just sit on it and wait until like next week's team meeting, drop a note in the project chat or whatever platforms they're using and say, Hey, that draft is complete. I'm moving on to review the next brief or I'm starting on the next piece of writing, just signals that you're kind of building momentum. I think as well, one thing that's looking really positive is the fact that this new place seems really proactive about scheduling in like calls if we need and being able to touch base. And I think having that structure really helps. But yeah, being able to implement it yourself and provide check-ins, even if it's with other members of the team and not necessarily management, that's definitely going to be useful. Absolutely. I mean, I'd say one thing to be aware of is your boss is gonna be. Incredibly busy, particularly in a startup, he'll probably move or cancel one-to-ones with you some weeks. That doesn't mean he doesn't want an update. So just a short email or a Slack message to say, here's how I'm getting on, or I've just had some thoughts about what I could do next with this, just wanted to check in with you. That's really gonna go a long way. So yeah, keep everyone informed. Just remember that. Keep everyone informed. Now that's enough from me. You were gonna look into what are some of the top concerns of Gen Z and Gen X starting a new job. What did you come up with? Well, just like so many other topics that we've covered, they actually have a lot more in common with their first 90-day challenges than you might think. Three key things came up. The first is the challenges of working remotely, as we've discussed a little bit here. So for Gen Z, we're worried about being isolated and not asking questions as we're getting started because we're worried about looking stupid. You know, I feel like I've heard there's no silly questions so many times, but then that doesn't make you feel any less sillier asking questions. So we just start to fade into the background a little bit, and then it's really difficult to recover from once you've set that baseline. Yeah. And then for Gen X, your tendency is to fire off long emails or start arranging half-hour meetings with colleagues to go through things. And you remember what we spoke about with Gabby Rossley about intergenerational working? Yeah. Yeah. So younger colleagues might have different preferences. So maybe just a quick chat message, like you mentioned, a little post on Slack or a post on a Trello board is all they need. So yeah, you should start by asking people how they like to be updated. Yeah, Gen X often feel isolated remotely so they can over-correct by trying to kind of replicate the office online, so scheduling all those Zoom calls, expecting immediate answers to Slack messages, which can really frustrate younger people, I think, who prefer their uninterrupted deep work time. Yeah. So yeah, they they should allow for kind of protecting the team's focus time. So as Gabby said, you just adjust your approach. Assume an email might take 24 hours for someone to reply to, Slack message might take a couple of hours. If it's urgent, then it's a phone call, but that's kind of emergencies only. So yeah, Gen X do need to think about how the other generations are are working and what their preferences are. Yeah, respecting each other, respecting generational differences is definitely the key thing there. And then the second thing is about the tech. So Gen Z is often expected to know how to use every SaaS product out there without any training because we're seen as digital natives. But how are we supposed to keep up if we've never worked in a professional environment before? You know, we don't have any experience to go off of. So when we start a new job, please support us with some training on the tech you use because, for example, I'm not very digitally savvy, even though I grew up on my phone and on tech all the time. And then if you're a Gen Z starting out like me, ask for proper training on them. And then the quicker we get to know how to use them properly, the more productive we can be as well. Absolutely. On the flip side of that, for Gen X, there can often be some bias that you guys are, you know, tech dinosaurs, and you can also hide any tech confusion, maybe out of shame a little bit, or you can overcompensate by acting like you already know how to use things. Same applies, really. So asking for some support, you can reference the products you do know how to use if you don't want people to think you're completely out of touch. So you could say, We used Trello at my last company, but I've never used ClickUp or Slack before. Could you point me in the right direction of where I can find some info on how to set it up? You know, is there a YouTube video I could watch? Is there a uh video reference thing that we've got? And the third thing is about building relationships. So for Gen Z just starting out, they need to learn how to manage upwards and understand the pressure that busy bosses are under. So being efficient in how much time you ask for and prioritizing what you actually want to ask and what you need to know to move your projects forward, kind of slimming things down there. And for Gen X, you might be joining in a role that some of your team members or colleagues applied for, and they might be threatened by an outsider here. So you need to tread carefully to start with. It all feels a bit high school, doesn't it? This is making me think the the social hierarchy kind of side of things. My first job in HR, which was when it was called personnel, so that tells you how long ago it was, or it will tell the other Gen Xers who are listening to this how long ago it was. I felt like I was a playground monitor a lot of the time. I was dealing with like store managers for a big retail organization, and it was just like playground stuff. I know you can see why they make so many reality TV shows out of workplace dramas. Yeah. Because it's like real life. So circling back to that last point, you also need to watch yourself starting sentences with at my old company, you know, don't come in and try and change everything. Take the time to learn why things are done the way they are in the new place. Like I mentioned before, this is what's happened to me so much of the time in hospitality when you get new managers and they start rearranging things that are in a specific place for a specific reason. So, yeah, the better approach is to have short meetings with your team and your peers in the first 30 days and ask everyone three questions. What's working really well here? What's our biggest bottleneck? And what are you hoping I will fix? So that's really good information. You can base any changes you want to make on, but don't just go around willy-nilly moving things around, please. Yeah. Good point. And I would add one more specific thing to the remote hybrid model. Yeah. And that is Loom or its equivalent. So if you're a Gen X senior executive trying to show a younger team member your tech savvy, stop typing out a massive strategy document, record a two-minute Loom video walking through the strategy, and it shows you know how to use modern async tools and saves everyone a meeting and it kind of humanizes you. Yeah. And for some of us, I would much rather watch a video than have to go through a full document. I think that's a lot easier. If you've got the technology, make use of it. So, all really good stuff. Now, for some other quickfire advice, as I think you saw last week, I went out to my LinkedIn community to ask for some top tips for you starting your new role, and some really good ideas came back. I started with uh grandad's advice, keep everyone informed. And the other thing he told me that stuck with me was never overexplain. Yeah, just say what it is and and stop and then have a conversation. And if something does go wrong at work, there's always grandma's advice. Learn the lesson, forget the experience. We've both drawn on that for all sorts of different things. And here are some of the other tips that I got. Mike said, don't feel any pressure to be perfect straight away. And I talked about that. No one's uh putting those kind of expectations on you in in week one, hopefully. Similarly, Amanda said, don't walk in pretending to know everything, keep an open mind, chat to other people that have done your job. And if you want, be honest about any nerves. People usually respond really well to that kind of honesty. So if you're nervous or unsure about something, don't be afraid to speak up. Ed said, turn up to meetings a couple of minutes early, even if they're online. You'll build stronger relationships if you're there for some of the chit chat before the meeting starts properly. Now, I know you are very rarely early for anything, but now is a good time to start. So if there's like a 10 o'clock meeting in the diary, try and join like 9.57, 9.58. I think 9.57 is manageable. I think okay. And and then you'll be there for a bit of chit-chat, which is good for relationship, particularly. Yeah, yeah, absolutely. So uh, you know, you won't get to see everyone in the office, so you can do it online. Isioma suggested scheduling meetings with the key stakeholders for what you're going to be working on, and that will help you integrate into the culture. And they'll often tell you things you didn't ask for, but are really helpful to know. So just those early meetings in that induction phase. Erin simply said, do what you say you're going to do. That is a brilliant guiding principle, absolutely vital. Ties in with that underpromise over deliver thing. So delivering when you said you would or before. And Kinsko said, take notes, ask questions, and be patient with yourself. And as we said earlier, ask people for their preferences for email, chat, or a call, how, when to ask for their help. So hopefully that gives you some good tips to get off to the best possible start. Yeah, definitely. Thanks everyone. Those are all going to be stored. How are you feeling now compared to when we started? I actually feel really good. I feel like that was really, really helpful. And I'm very grateful for the extra bits of advice at the end. But definitely going through the 30, 60, 90 days is super helpful. Breaking it down into those chunks and kind of goals, that'll be really, really useful. So it's a good way to frame it. Just take sort of one month at a time. What do you think is gonna prove most useful for you? I think it's actually really reassuring to hear from you guys that it's okay to say that I'm maybe nervous about something or I need a bit more support and soaking up information in those first 30 days as opposed to thinking that I need to know everything straight away, I need to prove myself. I think that's really, really helpful. And also the fact that it's okay for me to ask questions specifically about the tech side of things is ironic given this is kind of like a techie role, but I do definitely need some support sometimes. You know what? I'm like dad logging on to these Zoom calls and I can't find the links after time. So yeah, hopefully that won't be the case at at work. But I I think there are so many different platforms and systems and apps out there, no one can keep up with all of them, and it's different from one company to the next. So I don't think there'll be an expectation that you will know it and that you've not worked in a kind of office environment before. So yeah, just just ask, and I'm sure they'll be supportive. I hope they'll be supportive because they've brought you in as an intern, so that they should put some of that support in place. So maybe 90 days from now, we do a little follow-up episode with how were the first 90 days and you know what you're looking forward to about what comes next. But but congratulations on landing the job. It's really exciting. Thank you. And hope that has been useful. It has. Thank you. If you've found this discussion useful, maybe you're in a position where you're about to start a new job or are thinking about moving to something new. Hopefully, this will stand you in good stead. If you've enjoyed it, please give us a uh rating and review on your favorite podcast app. That really helps us uh grow the show. And for our next episode, we are going to be looking at wellness culture. So stay tuned for that. Thanks for listening to this episode of the Gen XD Exchange.